Saxophonist Ken Vandermark — widely regarded as one of the most creative and prolific forces in free jazz and improvised music — will perform in San Antonio this Friday with an ensemble comprised of four Texas musicians exploring similar sonic territory.
For the show at the Blue Star’s Slab Cinema Arthouse, Chicago-based Vandermark will be joined by the Chicago/Texas Sound Ensemble, which consists of drummer Kory Cook (San Antonio), guitarist Jonathan Horne (Austin), vibraphonist Stefan Gonzalez (Dallas) and bassist Matthew Frerck (Denton).
The group, which originally came together last year to perform with Vandermark at Austin’s No Idea Festival, is also scheduled to play in Austin and Dallas on this run.
Vandermark has drawn critical acclaim for his work as an improviser, composer, bandleader and collaborator, playing in a dizzying number of ensembles that have explored the reaches of avant-garde jazz, free improvisation, funk, reggae and more.
Along the way, he’s collaborated with luminaries ranging from boundary-pushing German saxophonist Peter Brötzmann to American free jazz multi-instrumentalist Joe McPhee.
Vandermark’s 1999 album Straight Lines, which paid tribute to under-appreciated free jazz pioneer Joe Harriott, earned the Chicago musician a MacArthur Foundation “genius grant.” The esteemed award recognizes people across a range of fields who show “extraordinary originality and dedication in their creative pursuits.”
The Current caught up with Vandermark via phone to talk about how the Chicago/Texas Sound Ensemble came together, what audiences can expect to hear and the changes he’s seen in the improvised music scene since he began putting his stamp on it during the early 1990s.
What convinced you this grouping of musicians was worth revisiting for a tour?
Well, I got asked to do a residency by [Austin musician] Chris Cogburn last May and used his advice about musicians to collaborate with to do some pieces of mine. He suggested Kory and Jonathan, Stefan and Matthew. We just hit it off. The chemistry was fantastic. I mean, they were super-excited to do the work. They were there right on time for the rehearsals. They worked really hard on the music ahead of time and things came together so fast. And when we did the concert right from the first note, you could feel that Thelonious Monk quote about lifting the band stand. The energy just shot up and we finished the first piece. There was actually silence initially after it ended — people were that blown away — and finally erupted with enthusiastic applause. So, it was like, “Whoa, this is something.” And the whole concert was like that.
When we finished, it was clear to me I would really want to work together again with the four of them and they felt the same way. So, we took some planning to get the thing to happen now, and that’s why it’s taken place.
So, it was a rehearsed performance then and there were composed elements.
Oh, yeah. I brought in stuff that I thought would be easy. Some of my compositions are not intentionally complicated, but they end up being that way. So, I tried to bring in stuff that would be easy to learn quickly and rehearse quickly — and that proved to be the case. We’re actually playing a bunch of my tunes, and this time, everybody’s bringing in material. I’ll have six pieces in the book to present and everybody else is, I think, bringing in a single piece. So, there will be about 10 pieces, all original music, which is the goal of the project. It’s based around compositional work and improvisation.
Has there been any thought about recording with this group, or will you be doing a recording while you’re here?
The plan is to do these performances and hone in on the material. And then I’m going to come back to Texas in August of all times to record with everybody in Austin. We’ll record the material that we’re working on now.
Which is a good segue into my next question. You’re quite prolific in gigging, in recording and in the sheer number of people you’ve been able to collaborate with over the years. How do you manage to make all that work?
I guess enthusiasm and discipline. I mean, there are so many interesting people out there to collaborate with, and the thing it always comes down to is time and money — having the time to get together and coordinate projects. For example, the project we’re talking about now took a year to pull it together, for us to be able to reconvene. And the plan is to do this recording and then do a tour in the Midwest in 2027. So, things get staggered out pretty far because everyone’s schedules and whatnot. It’s kind of like a juggling act with all these different things happening and keeping up with them. You just get used to doing it, because it’s so exciting to work with people of that caliber and to be challenged. I mean, I just love it. … I’m just as enthusiastic now as I was then to work with people that are hyper-creative and have a lot to say.
You have been a fixture in avant-garde jazz and improvised music since the 1990s. How has that scene, especially in the United States, changed since then?
Well, I mean, I’m most familiar with the scenes in Chicago and New York, but I know there’s stuff going on all over the place in the States, and I try to follow things and keep up with what’s happening. I think the biggest change from my point of view is from when I first came up is that there are a lot more people involved in the scene who have come out of conservatory backgrounds, finished a program in composition or performance or whatnot. You see it a lot in Chicago. A lot of the younger players I work with have degrees from conservatories, and when I was first starting out that was less true, or there were people who would start a program and shift out of it and either move into other areas of study or just drop it completely.
That’s changed the music, because the information they’re receiving is through an academic background. I’m not saying that’s worse, but it’s different than trying to find the information off of records. The access now to information is so staggeringly different than in the mid ‘80s. I mean, there wasn’t the internet.
So, it’s hard to appreciate the before and after unless you were there before. A lot of what’s normal for someone that’s 20 now is very different than what was normal for me when I was 20, and that’s impacted the scene. There’s a lot of information they’ve got. They can check out things that I couldn’t even hear, and the set of resources I think is really significant and has affected the skillsets of the players.
The players that I’m encountering have way more tools than I had at the same age — way more. They’re better readers, they’ve got more technique. And the thing is at the end of the day, it’s still about ideas and that’s the real content, the real creative content. I’m not talking social media content, I’m talking about actual work and content that drives the forms that are being used. So, whatever skills you’ve got, it’s still about the ideas and where the ideas come from.
This music itself has a limited but very appreciative audience. Even for people who are considered important pillars of the improvised music scene, a good show might be playing to 60 people in an art gallery. How have you managed for all these years to keep forging ahead without succumbing to the occasional disappointment that, yeah, playing to 60 people in an art gallery may be as good as it gets. And I don’t mean to sound like that’s a bad gig, just that being at the top of your game in a more accessible form of music can attract a larger audience with a bigger financial reward.
No, I understand where you’re coming from. I mean, the first thing is I love it. I love playing. But there’s always one or two whatever times a year where I’m on a stage somewhere wondering why — not why I’m doing what I’m doing, but why I’m doing it in that particular scenario. And usually that’s because the presenter hasn’t done the work on their end or you’re having an off night. Which is why I like to tour, because then you can come back and try the next night somewhere else and present the music and tackle it.
But the process of working with improvisation and music is still fascinating to me. I’ve had so many extraordinary experiences that have brought me around the world by pursuing it, and I get to work with such incredible people. Even on the worst night, that’s always there for me in the back of my head that this is such an extraordinary privilege to get to do what I get to do, and I love it. I mean, I truly do, and that hasn’t dissipated.
Even though, to your point, it’s challenging music, and that means it’s challenging for audiences and the people that want to go into a room together and listen and experience the kind of music I’m making and the kind of music my colleagues make. But there’s also something so intimate and powerful about that. It’s not about the numbers, it’s about the passion.
I remember talking to [pianist] John Tilbury of [British free improvisation group] AMM, and he told me AMM had a gig and there were like four people in the audience, but one of them was Ornette Coleman. So how do you define what’s significance? You know what I mean?
With regard to San Antonio and the other Texas shows, what should folks expect to hear?
A lot of energy, man. I mean really propulsive excitement. I just was so thrilled to play with these guys. And I mean, I knew Stephan a little bit. I knew Jonathan a little bit. I hadn’t worked with any of them before [the No Idea Festival], but just the chemistry. I mean, that’s the thing: you can have great players play together and the music can be good, but sometimes the chemistry just hits. And with this particular lineup of people, the chemistry was so great.
So the interplay between the musicians as the music rips, and the kinds of pieces that we’re going to be playing, it will have that kind of punk rock attitude, which I really love. It’s like, “You’re here, let it just fly.” It’s not going to be precious music. It’s not going to be safe music. It’s going to explore a wide range of aesthetics, really free time things. One of the pieces, it’s not really a ballad, more a sort of blues piece for the trio that’s more introspective, but not precious.
Anything else you think is important to touch on about the upcoming performance or the state of improvised music in general?
Well, I’m excited about this collaboration between a set of the musical history out of Chicago and this history out of Texas. There’s a long history of jazz and improvised music in Texas and the sensibilities, the interplay between them and the collision of these ideas. It really is what it says in the name: a Chicago/Texas Sound Ensemble. And that part of it I’m excited about, and I’m excited to see how that’s going to develop in terms of the hybrid that’s going to go on with those guys’ histories in mind. I’m just excited to come down and play. I’m ready for it, man.
$10 suggested donation, 8 p.m. Friday, May 22, Slab Cinema Arthouse, 134 Blue Star, (210) 212-9373, slabcinemaarthouse.com.
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